Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabilities??

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Kelly
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Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabilities??

Unread postby Kelly » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:49 pm

Server: MODS#4
Halo Name: A§H»Kelly
Ban Date: Sunday, March 2nd
Ban Time: around 10:00pm Eastern (U.S.)
PÕQ Players in server: I don't remember
Banlist entry: 56b76bc7765021e7659fc2fa7b8cb521
Explanation: I was banned because I pointed out what was either an incredibly improbable situation on POQ servers or strong evidence for cheating by POQ members.

Additional explanation: The server was repeatedly stacking the odds against me and my team for 7+ back-to-back games. My team was repeatedly loaded with players with kill rates less than 10 kills while opposing team having kills greater than 50-70!

(Most players were with the game from the start an not new. Despite this, my best teammate didn't exceed 10 kills. Everyone else was less than that. The majority (80%) of opposing team had approximately 60+ kills each) Again, this occurred every game over the course of 7 continuous games.

I understand that while rare, this can happen every once and a while. I wouldn't have said anything if it happened merely two or even three times... but every game for 7 games is massively improbable. I believe the game was strategically stacked against me because I was repeatedly winning game after game with 90% of flags and most kills over and over.

Though I still won the stacked games too... I don't like to be challenged using what I perceive to be cheating tactics if in fact thats what it was. I personally attribute this to either incredibly improbable odds or strong evidence for cheating by POQ members. (There was also strong evidence that some players might be sight jacking during these same games.)

This 7-game stretch was actually the latest example. It happens semi-frequently on POQ servers when I've played there. I was bitter about it however I was still inclined to accept the previous examples as instances of improbable chance however the 7-game stretch seemed far too improbable to sit silent about it.

I publicly referenced my grievances a few times in open chat and was asked by POQ members or admins (I don't know who is an admin here) to repeat it in public chat multiple times as new members joined.

Part of my ban is supposedly referencing this point in public chat this despite the fact that POQ members requesting that I repeat the offending comments publicly.

The proper course of action (in my opinion) would be to at least discuss the problem openly. (That did not happen.) However, if open chat isn't an acceptable discussion area for such topics then POQ members should let me know where the proper location is to discuss these matters so that they get the attention they deserve and be investigated and resolved.

If no such policy exists and non-member players are not allowed to talk about POQ cheaters (if only because its' assumed that PÕQ Clan members would never cheat or that non POQ members are not allowed to expose POQ cheaters) then a warning would instead be in order. (I received no such warning.)

Instead, AFTER I was permanently IP banned on all servers, I was told that I am not allowed to reference POQ cheating in any capacity whether it be legitimate or not. That's bad policy in my opinion. I would be happy to offer some constructive criticism on clan policy but this is not the forum for that so I won't unless asked-to.

I was neither warned, kicked, temporary-single-server-banned or even temporary-multi-server-banned. Instead, I received the most extreme punishment for this non-offenceive "offense" that this clan could possibly issue.

I was permanently multi-server IP banned!

I think this was BEYOND excessive.

Hopefully you agree now that you understand where I'm coming from.

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PÕQ~NovaLad
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Re: Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabiliti

Unread postby PÕQ~NovaLad » Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:48 am

I've seen newbies cry "cheater" when they don't know what they are talking about but you are taking the cake here.

The machinations required to perform the cheats you are suggesting are not just ridiculous but are indicative of extreme paranoia in need of medication. There is nothing worse than a player who can't handle being pwn'd who calls "CHEATER!" in a fit of adolescent angst.

If you think someone is cheating, you contact the Leaders---you don't challenge the honesty and integrity of our clan in OUR server.

I've read the transcript of our server logs and your behavior was way beyond the pail. You were RUDE, HOSTILE, NASTY and SLANDEROUS (well, it would be slander if Halo weren't JUST A GAME!).

We at PÕQ Clan spend SIGNIFICANT effort to control cheating in our servers. Many of our seasoned players (myself among them) are VERY good at catching them. On the VERY rare occasion when we do catch a POQ member cheating-- we expel them, immediately and forever. PÕQ Clan DOES NOT TOLERATE CHEATING OF ANY KIND.

I have played with you on DI many times (usually UC) and you are a good team mate and a good opponent. If you were showing ANY kind of a hint of sign that MAYBE you realized you were just a bit out of line, a little over-reactive...I'd be on your side here and arguing for a second chance.

However it is clear that you can not see beyond the chip on your shoulder and are not capable of civil and reasonable discourse.

Enjoy yourself on ASH servers.

-NL
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PÕQ~Technut
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Re: Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabiliti

Unread postby PÕQ~Technut » Wed Mar 05, 2014 3:29 am

Just to clarify... You weren't banned for one incident.

On at least 5 different days you have publicly accused PÕQ or our members of cheating by SightJacking, cheating by having stronger shielding than other players, or cheating by stacking the teams. Even after you were assured that you were wrong, instead of apologizing you continued to make false accusations in our servers. And just for the record, those are all false accusations.

You have also been caught recruiting for ASH clan in our servers.

All of that is unacceptable behavior and you should have known that since you are a member of a clan that supposedly does not tolerate such things in their own servers. So why would you expect us to tolerate it in ours?

:xmark You are not welcome back due to your repeated and ongoing rude behavior. Unban request declined.



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Kelly
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Re: Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabiliti

Unread postby Kelly » Wed Mar 05, 2014 10:50 am

PÕQ~Technut wrote:On at least 5 different days you have publicly accused PÕQ or our members of cheating by SightJacking, cheating by having stronger shielding than other players


I've been playing this game a minimum of two hours every single day since the day it was released. As a result, I've attained a refined level of skill that tells me when something is out of the ordinary. With that said, it doesn't require that level of skill to know that when you hit somebody twice with a rocket launcher, a grenade and then get pegged by 4 shotguns blasts (all of which hit) and the person doesn't die that something is going wrong. Similarly, if the same person continually manages to find where you are despite being in a new spot and does so once after another that is highly improbable. It indicates sightjacking.



PÕQ~Technut wrote:or cheating by stacking the teams.


I already referenced how improbable it is for the team stacking to come about naturally.


PÕQ~Technut wrote:Even after you were assured that you were wrong


Do you usually ask thieves if they stole? Were you to do so, I would wager that they would deny it. Why would this logic not apply to cheaters?


PÕQ~Technut wrote:instead of apologizing you continued to make false accusations in our servers.


Continuing with the thief analogy.... would you apologize to the thief if he denied theft?



PÕQ~Technut wrote:And just for the record, those are all false accusations.


I'm curious. How do you know? You're so quick to deny it on their behalf yet you weren't there.



PÕQ~Technut wrote:You have also been caught recruiting for ASH clan in our servers.


I didn't know and nobody said not to



PÕQ~Technut wrote:All of that is unacceptable behavior and you should have known that since you are a member of a clan that supposedly does not tolerate such things in their own servers. So why would you expect us to tolerate it in ours?


I'm not an administrator for ASH. I don't know the rules and was never told them. I'm actually fairly new to the clan... (or any clan)



PÕQ~Technut wrote: :xmark You are not welcome back due to your repeated and ongoing rude behavior. Unban request declined.


You have a history of being unreasonable and overzealous. I see that has not changed. :headbang


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Kelly
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Re: Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabiliti

Unread postby Kelly » Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:34 am

PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:I've seen newbies cry "cheater" when they don't know what they are talking about but you are taking the cake here.


Are you calling me a newbie? Seriously? I would wager I have 5x the hours played on this game that your most avid players in this clan. I'm not saying this to be boastful but because I invest an unhealthy amount of time to this game every single day and have done so since the game was released. If my accusations sounds like cries its perhaps because they fall on deaf ears. I'm not inclined to respect the cheat denials of those who I accuse of cheating. If there's a proper forum for referencing these things I'm not inclined to believe that this too is irrelevant as the accusations were completely denied by this clan's owner without so much as an investigation.

PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:The machinations required to perform the cheats you are suggesting are not just ridiculous but are indicative of extreme paranoia in need of medication.


Hardly. An admin need only switch underperforming players to one side.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:There is nothing worse than a player who can't handle being pwn'd who calls "CHEATER!" in a fit of adolescent angst.


Agreed and yet I was not pwn'd. I managed to win the vast majority of those games despite the stacked teams and did so not only with typically 9 out of 15 flags but also with most kills as well.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote: If you think someone is cheating, you contact the Leaders---you don't challenge the honesty and integrity of our clan in OUR server.


I don't know who this clans leaders are and when I've asked I've been told to drop it.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:I've read the transcript of our server logs and your behavior was way beyond the pail. You were RUDE, HOSTILE, NASTY and SLANDEROUS (well, it would be slander if Halo weren't JUST A GAME!).


Don't mistake in-game-taunting with rudeness. It's part of the game. Accusations that you assume to be false aren't slanderous if in fact there's evidence for truth.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:We at PÕQ Clan spend SIGNIFICANT effort to control cheating in our servers.


If so then why is my character being assented for bringing your attention to these issues? I agree that nobody likes to be called a cheater however if one's team is accused for as much it's time to investigate if you do intact take these issues seriously.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:Many of our seasoned players (myself among them) are VERY good at catching them.


I am what you would call a seasoned player and am VERY good at catching them too. You don't have to accept my accusations as factual however I would hope that you wouldn't be so quick to disregard them if in fact I've shown myself to be a skilled player.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:On the VERY rare occasion when we do catch a POQ member cheating-- we expel them, immediately and forever. PÕQ Clan DOES NOT TOLERATE CHEATING OF ANY KIND.


I should hope not however this clan's indifference and denial of these accusations from a seasoned player compels me to think your standards might not be as refined as you believe they are.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:I have played with you on DI many times (usually UC) and you are a good team mate and a good opponent.


Thank you. Please let this act as an expression of my skills that suggest that I'm not a newbie bitter about being beaten


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:If you were showing ANY kind of a hint of sign that MAYBE you realized you were just a bit out of line, a little over-reactive...I'd be on your side here and arguing for a second chance.


There is always the chance that anomaly's occur that would indicate false positives. This is why I intentionally use words like "improbable" rather than "impossible." I've already suggested that there might have been a more appropriate forum to raise these questions. This is my concession if that's what you're looking for.

Could you consider the notion that I might actually (gasp) be right and that this clan under-reacted to these accusations? If you consider the fact that thus far the all it has done is deny the claims without even considering that possibility then perhaps you might think otherwise.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:However it is clear that you can not see beyond the chip on your shoulder and are not capable of civil and reasonable discourse.


I believe that my actions thus far are the pinnacle of reasonable and proper discourse. I've jumped through all your hoops to explain my actions. I've sat in your teamspeak for two days now in hopes of talking with an admin to address these issues in a civilized way. I don't need POQ servers as there are many alternatives to play including my own clan's who's maps and mods are identical to your own. I've made these efforts solely to right a perceived wrong.


PÕQ~NovaLad wrote:Enjoy yourself on ASH servers.


Will do. Come join me some time.

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PÕQ~NovaLad
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Re: Banned for pointing out cheaters / massive improbabiliti

Unread postby PÕQ~NovaLad » Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:38 am

Kelly, I don't care how much you've played--you don't know squat about the mechanics of the client/server dynamic of the game.

There is no such thing as a "superman" hack. The shields on our maps are the same for everyone. You are almost invulnerable for the 1st second but EVERYONE is killable with enough firepower. Now, LATENCY can cause what appears a kill to you as being zero-hit to the player. You think you shot them, but because of Latency they actually were not in the spot where you shot. This is a factor in ALL network games.

If I could send a quarter through the forums to you, I would. You really need to buy a clue before you open your trap.

Please take your deluded rant elsewhere.

Your unban is denied.

Goodbye.
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